Knitting

Re: Knitting: Thanks for your follow up

Postby tahanson43206 » Sun Sep 13, 2015 1:48 pm

In reply to Billy ...

Thank you for your follow up on the Smithsonian inquiry!

Yesterday, while channel surfing, I found a travel show which had stopped by a rug making shop in (what I think was) India. The owner of the shop showed how thread for the loom is made from 500 strands of silk, and he then explained how many cocoons are needed to make a rug. The number was in the thousands.

The owner estimated that it would take the weaver a couple of months to complete the rug she was building from a visual model she had mounted on the right of the loom.

There were (probably) hundreds of threads string taut in the vertical dimension. The weaver selected the colored thread she needed for a spot on the rug, wound it around two vertical threads, and then pulled the colored loop down to the current working line. Periodically the weaver pulled a tool with studs similar to a horse brush from top to bottom of the vertical threads, to seat the current working line firmly.

A (relatively simple) robot could perform the weaving function. To my eye, there is no nobility in a life lived weaving, as the women in that shop had been doing. Both men and women are indoctrinated into the practice at very young ages, and they live their entire lives in the occupation. Only two of the workers could read, according to the owner.

However, for a recovering civilization, or more to the point in 2015, for a nascent civilization on the Moon or Mars, the ONLY way that weaving (as shown in the travelogue) makes sense is if it is done by robots.

In that case, the knowledge and skill needed is at the level required to manufacture the parts for the robot weavers, to assemble them, to program their movements and sensory feedback loops, and to maintain them.

A person capable of performing those functions would be mightily stretched mentally. In my estimation, that would be a life worth living, aside from the immediate contribution of woven rugs to the cave floor.

For anyone who chances across this post who is NOT familiar with current thinking on off-Earth habitation, for radiation protection, everyone will live in caves.

Call to Action: I would like to see a project to design, build and demonstrate a prototype robotic rug weaving system.

While the intent (in the context of this forum) is to provide for recovery of civilization after a disaster, a system able to weave a rug could become the basis of a small business in the United States and elsewhere.

It is even conceivable that the supply of human beings to weave rugs in India will dry up, as it becomes unfashionable to condemn human beings to such lives.

In that case, a well designed and affordable robot weaver could (presumably) end up in service in India.

(th)
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Re: Knitting: wire screen as example

Postby tahanson43206 » Tue Sep 15, 2015 5:21 pm

The pleasant weather in the local area inspired opening windows, which are protected by wire screens.

Wire screens are among the large number of products that fit well in the "Knitting" topic.

Large machines are (probably) used to make huge quantities of wire screen in the global economy of 2015.

The cost of these machines, their infrastructure and supplies, and the staff to support them is distributed over enough customers so that the enterprise is able to cover its expenses and reward it's owners for having taken the enormous risk involved.

I would like to see development of automation capable of operating at the community level, and affordable to the families present in the community.

Wire screens would then become objects for barter with other communities.

(th)
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Re: Knitting: Encouraging Reply from Museum

Postby tahanson43206 » Tue Sep 15, 2015 6:44 pm

Begin Quotation:
Mr. Hanson,

I am a Textiles Collection volunteer currently working on your request.

The Smithsonian Institution does have a set of drawings for an Early American Loom but this package is not currently in print. However, in response to your request, we are in the process of having the drawings and accompanying data (5 – 19” by 30” sheets plus 5 – 8-1/2” by 11” pages that include some instructions and references, etc.) digitized and put into a format that could be made available to you for your use. This may take an additional couple of weeks to complete, so we are requesting your continued patience.

Please let me know if there are additional questions or comments. Thank you very much for your interest.

v/r,
John De Jong
Reply, Reply All or For
End Quotation.
(th)
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Re: Knitting: Chain Mail Viable Knitting Alternative

Postby tahanson43206 » Wed Sep 16, 2015 5:04 pm

Trying to implement a loom concept with existing (or even predicted) 3D Printers, using traditional thread as a medium, will tax the talents of even the most creative machine designer.

Chain mail is a model for an alternative "knitting: technique that is worth considering for home or small community fabric manufacture.

There are several technical challenges.

The first I am inviting the "Knowledge" community to consider is a technique of squeezing small segments of liquid material in such a way that the material will naturally curl and bond its forward tip to the trailing tip when the segment is severed from the injector.

With such a technique in hand, a fabric could be built up with a single "print" head. While the time required would be significant, a prototype one head machine would inspire development of machines with additional heads, so that the rate of production could be increased.

It is also possible to envision construction of tubular fabric, which addresses the challenge of replicating existing T-shirt manufacture.

(th)
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Re: Knitting: Persian rug weaving robot inquiry

Postby tahanson43206 » Sat Sep 19, 2015 12:14 pm

Begin Quotation:
The context of this inquiry is the book "The Knowledge" by Dr. Lewis Dartnell, which is devoted to identification of crucial knowledge and skills that would be needed to rebuild civilization after a major disaster. The location of discussion is a web site managed by Dr. Dartnell, called: discuss.the-knowledge.org.
The topic of discussion is knitting, and the current focus of the discussion is use of robots to perform fabric assembly at a time when human beings are in limited supply. However, any technology developed for the instance of a disaster is likely to be applicable to the present day. That is certainly true of rug weaving, which still employs thousands of people who perform the same tasks for entire lifetimes, and (apparently) start these lives as children.
My question is whether Baxter or one of its relatives can be taught to insert thread into a vertical strand of threads, wrap the thread around two of the vertical elements, and tap the loop thus created down onto the build line.
I presume that (if Baxter can perform the required actions), then it can be programmed to select colors of threads from a program. Humans performing these tasks for a large Persian rug can take up to two months or more to complete the project. I presume Baxter can complete the task in less time.
Thanks for your interest in this inquiry.
(th)
End Quotation.
The above was submitted to Rethink Robotics 2015/09/19.
Any reply will be reported here.
(th)
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Re: Knitting: Persian Rug Sales: Portraits

Postby tahanson43206 » Sat Sep 19, 2015 12:51 pm

Members of discuss.the-knowledge.org forum are invited to add to the list of applications for a robotic Persian rug weaving system.

Portraits of ancestors (or even living persons) rendered in the Persian rug format may be of interest to consumers in 2015 and after.

Landscapes taken from digital images are of possible interest for public venues, or perhaps upper scale private lodging.

Adapting from another thread in the forum, preservation of knowledge using this technique is possible, so schools or libraries may be interested.

(th)
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Re: Knitting: Documents Delivered by Smithsonian

Postby tahanson43206 » Thu Oct 08, 2015 1:47 am

The good news is: A pdf file arrived today. It contains what appear to be copies of original documents, followed by detailed drawings to make a loom.

The bad news is: The gent who sent the file says it still contains a Smithsonian marker of some kind, so it can only be used for personal study.

I ** think ** that means it can be used by individuals, but not made generally available. The "honor" system, apparently.

More good news is: the pdf file is readable.

More bad news is: the pdf file is a mixture of at least two file specifications, so it is difficult to work with. I tried Adobe and the Windows 10 browser reader, and got different results.

One viewer shows the original documents at full size in rich golden color but abends when the plans try to render.

The other viewer shows the original documents as tiny icons, but shows the plans in fine detail.

I'll report back "soon" with more results. I'll also try Linux pdf reader, to see if it can do any better than the Windows software.

Aside from the challenges for working with the file, it appears that a reasonably handy person could make a loom using these plans.

Thanks again to Billy, who first reported this opportunity.

(th)
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Re: Knitting

Postby Maurice Goldsmith » Thu Oct 08, 2015 6:16 am

Hi th

Congratulations for getting a result, and well done for pursuing this.

Maurice
I am the author of a post-apocalyptic novel - The Lucifer Bug http://www.theluciferbug.com/
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Re: Knitting: Reply to Smithsonian 2015/10/08

Postby tahanson43206 » Thu Oct 08, 2015 3:16 pm

Begin Quotation:
To DeJongJ@si.edu Today at 11:12 AM
For Mr. DeJong
Smithsonian Institution

Thank you very much for the work you and your associates have done to make the inventiveness and industry of our predecessors available to the current generation!

Per your request, the file will be shared with individuals who are interested in the history of technology. My hope is to find at least a few individuals who will be inspired to re-create the loom.

Ultimately, if I interpret Dr. Dartnell's vision correctly, it would be desirable to develop a working knowledge of early technology in isolated but communicating pockets of the current population.

After a few days or perhaps weeks, I may be able to provide feedback on our success with the file.

(th)
Columbus, Ohio

DeJong, John <DeJongJ@si.edu>
To Tom Hanson
CC Shaw, Madelyn OC-Toshiba Winkle, Timothy
Oct 7 at 6:54 PM
Mr. Hanson,

A preliminary, digital (i.e., .pdf format) version of the requested "Early American Loom" plans is attached: it still contains a Smithsonian Institution copyright notice, so I am requesting that you consider it for personal use only at this time. We think you would be doing us a great service to assume the role of "beta tester" for this version and let us know if it meets your needs/expectations (I have already confessed internally that the individual page sizes are wildly unreal - but as long as no one prints a page "Actual size" - instead of "Fit" or "Shrink oversize pages" - it may be manageable; also, I'm not sure how the pages in color will print on representative printers - especially b/w ones). The intent was to have an easy way of getting to the plan(s) for each part via the pdf bookmarks feature, i.e., so the "Exploded Parts Diagram" serves as a Table of Contents for the individual part drawings. Again, your user comments/suggestions would certainly be appreciated.

The intent is to coordinate with all the stakeholders in order to make these plans fully user-friendly and freely available (if possible) directly from the Smithsonian Institution's web site. This will likely take awhile, hence the decision to invite you to be part of the process in the "beta tester" role. Thank you very much for your forbearance as we work through this process.

v/r,
John
End Quotation.
(th)
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Re: Knitting: Advance: Artificial silk

Postby tahanson43206 » Sun Nov 08, 2015 3:49 am

The link below points to a report on development of artificial silk.

http://www.cnet.com/news/stronger-than- ... -clothing/

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